The ME-TV BATMAN Episode Discussion Thread

[High C]

I like the Zodiac Crimes, but I thought it was padded in places. Since it had two writers, I wonder if maybe it started out as a two-part Joker story and was padded out into three parts to accommodate Penguin, especially since he isn’t in the second episode. Does anyone know? I’m sure the plot point about Venus defecting and helping Batman was Stephen Kandell’s idea, since it echoed Blaze joining Batman in the False-Face episodes that Kandell wrote. To be honest, though, one of the things that knocks the episode down a few notches for me is I just didn’t like Terry Moore. She is a pretty bad actress and I found her to be one of the least attractive molls on the entire series. I think a better Venus would have added

I've said on this board many times I thought Terry Moore's performance as a moll was not very good, so I certainly agree with you. She seemed to be going for some breathless faux Marilyn Monroe vibe and it simply didn't work. Granted, she wasn't helped by the script or the direction, but still. . .

Also, an interesting thing about this episode is that according to the script and spec script titles in Dozier's files at the University of Wyoming, it began as a Kandel story titled 'The Astrologer.' That's all I know--the title. I wonder if upon examining the script outline we might find it actually was for a new villain called the Astrologer, and then adapted to fit Joker.

Maybe someday I'll go to Laramie and find out the answers to these and many other Bat-conundrums!

[NJ_Batfan]

I like the Zodiac Crimes, but I thought it was padded in places. Since it had two writers, I wonder if maybe it started out as a two-part Joker story and was padded out into three parts to accommodate Penguin, especially since he isn’t in the second episode. Does anyone know? I’m sure the plot point about Venus defecting and helping Batman was Stephen Kandell’s idea, since it echoed Blaze joining Batman in the False-Face episodes that Kandell wrote. To be honest, though, one of the things that knocks the episode down a few notches for me is I just didn’t like Terry Moore. She is a pretty bad actress and I found her to be one of the least attractive molls on the entire series. I think a better Venus would have added

I've said on this board many times I thought Terry Moore's performance as a moll was not very good, so I certainly agree with you. She seemed to be going for some breathless faux Marilyn Monroe vibe and it simply didn't work. Granted, she wasn't helped by the script or the direction, but still. . .

Also, an interesting thing about this episode is that according to the script and spec script titles in Dozier's files at the University of Wyoming, it began as a Kandel story titled 'The Astrologer.' That's all I know--the title. I wonder if upon examining the script outline we might find it actually was for a new villain called the Astrologer, and then adapted to fit Joker.

Maybe someday I'll go to Laramie and find out the answers to these and many other Bat-conundrums!

I have read that the three parters were planned as a first anniversary of sorts, tying in with another of the winter replacement series launches that ABC dubbed the "Second Season."

[Dr. Shimel]

I like the Zodiac Crimes, but I thought it was padded in places. Since it had two writers, I wonder if maybe it started out as a two-part Joker story and was padded out into three parts to accommodate Penguin, especially since he isn’t in the second episode. Does anyone know? I’m sure the plot point about Venus defecting and helping Batman was Stephen Kandell’s idea, since it echoed Blaze joining Batman in the False-Face episodes that Kandell wrote. To be honest, though, one of the things that knocks the episode down a few notches for me is I just didn’t like Terry Moore. She is a pretty bad actress and I found her to be one of the least attractive molls on the entire series. I think a better Venus would have added

I've said on this board many times I thought Terry Moore's performance as a moll was not very good, so I certainly agree with you. She seemed to be going for some breathless faux Marilyn Monroe vibe and it simply didn't work. Granted, she wasn't helped by the script or the direction, but still. . .

Also, an interesting thing about this episode is that according to the script and spec script titles in Dozier's files at the University of Wyoming, it began as a Kandel story titled 'The Astrologer.' That's all I know--the title. I wonder if upon examining the script outline we might find it actually was for a new villain called the Astrologer, and then adapted to fit Joker.

Maybe someday I'll go to Laramie and find out the answers to these and many other Bat-conundrums!

I believe "The Astrologer" was supposed to be played by Robert Morley, but that never came to pass, and had heard that the character somehow morphed into Sandman, with Joker using the astrology storyline.

[gothosmansion]

That very thing was the biggest issue I had with the pilot episode, when Riddler makes a "Robin" mask for Molly. Robin is unconscious and captive, you need to make a mold of his face, but don't take off his mask to do it? It made no sense at all, and Batman said the flaws in the nostrils of the mask were the giveaway. I just don't see HOW you could make a mold of the face without taking off that face's mask.

But how many times did the caped crusaders regain consciousness only to find themselves in a death trap without their utility belts, but no one bothered to remove their masks while they were out cold?

I think the biggest problem most people had with the pilot was that Jill St. John could pass as Robin by just putting a mask on! Of course, I realize this was part of the joke, but I've actually heard people comment on that.

Back to the current discussion, I hate to just repeat what other people have said, but the latest episode aired on MeTV "Batman's Anniversary/A Riddling Controversy" was a very good script that I think was marred by John Astin's portrayal of the Riddler, which paled next to Gorshin. On the other hand, Adam West named Deanna Lund as one of the most beautiful women he had ever worked with in his autobiography. While I don't know that I would rank her that highly, her character is a little more feisty than the average moll, which was fun, and she certainly was quite attractive. Actually, I saw her in a B-movie in the late 80s/early 90s called Roots of Evil, and she was STILL attractive, Any way, I didn't have any problems with Ms. Lund's casting in the episode.

As someone mentioned in another thread, a lot of the episode was taken from a comic book story.
I would like to mention the reason that the comic book story was a good one to adapt was that it was written by Batman's un-acknowleged co-creator, Bill Finger. Finger always had a lot of creative stuff in his stories and is probably the person most responsible for Batman's popularity. I think it is sad that Finger was responsible for so many wonderful stories and contributions to the Batman mythos that he never got credit for during his lifetime. The early comics only carried Bob Kane's byline. I know Finger's name was mentioned in a letter's column in 1964 where it was stated that he wrote Gotham Gang Line-Up, but I think the Clock King episodes of the TV series may have been the first time his name actually appeared on a Batman story that he wrote.

I really like the idea of flooding the bank, although I wish they had made the puzzle cage segment a bit more suspenseful. Having Robin just have to pull out one rod was sort-of anti-climactic.

[Gleeps, it's Batman]

Thanks to Gleeps for those great pictures from Scat.

I hope people don't mind me discussing a few episodes that you've already covered but I'm new to the board.

Welcome to the board, gothosmansion

I see the John Astin episodes didn't get much in the way of comment. I really have no comment either. The eps didn't do anything for me one way or the other.

Up next are two Joker episodes, as far as I know, but my internet is very spotty the last couple of days, so I can't really load my TV listings at the moment. I'm lucky to even be here on the boards because I haven't been able to load them. If Andy doesn't post about the next episodes, I'll try to grab some info to post, assuming my internet lets me and doesn't die on me again.

[Gleeps, it's Batman]

My internet is back, so here are the next two episodes, airing tonight:

THE JOKER'S LAST LAUGH (airdate 2/15/67) The Joker is busy slipping funny money into Gotham.

THE JOKER'S EPITAPH (airdate 2/16/67) The Joker has legally taken over the Gotham Bank and works on a devious scheme to force Bruce Wayne into a marriage with his moll Josie.

(taken from http://www.tv.com)

Anybody have any trivia to add?

[Gernot]

I was always curious what comicbook Robin was going to be pressed into in tonight's episode? Batman comics? Richie Rich? Spider-Man? Was this ever revealed?

[clavierankh]

I'm A big Joker fan but this was my least favorite of the first two seasons. First the robot henchman I didn't like. I missed the interaction between Joker as his stooges. It seemed like something was missing from the episode. Second the plot seemed improvised. Early in the episode Joker says he on the brink of the greatest criminal coup anyone ever dreamed of. We never find out what it is.

That being said there are some good things. The anti-lunatic squad hauling off Bruce Wayne, the Joker as a bank vice president . Josie telling Bruce she'll be faithful "in her way".

[AndyFish]

These episodes always felt closest to the comic books of the time, with the robots and Alfred conning folks into thinking he was Batman, etc.
Any Joker episode is a good episode in my book.

[clavierankh]

A couple thins I noticed.

Could anyone get a decent freeze frame of he counterfeit money? I was try to read what was written across it.It didn't look like United States of America.

I noticed freeze framing in the Joker's comic book company that the poster Josie moved to look through the peephole appeared to be a theater flier in Italian. I also saw some carnival looking posters. One said Princess Fatima and on said (I think) 3 tries for 10 cents.

Was the bustof Joker on the front of the Joke Mobile used in another episode, maybe the Joker's Wild?

[NJ_Batfan]

I noticed that the music played during the chase scene to the BatCave was recycled from the pilot. Evidently, it did not bother anyone that the Riddler's motif was being played while the Joker was on-camera.

Also, the continuity police were asleep as Bruce Wayne never acknowledges Mr. Whiteface as the Joker who kidnapped him in the feature, despite the fact that both these episodes and the movie were written by one Mr. Semple.

[gothosmansion]

Apparently, the Joker car was first built for the Elvis Presley movie Easy Come, Easy Go, minus the Joker head on the front, and on the surfboard style seats, of course.

While I am a big Elvis fan, that movie was pretty awful and had only one good song in it. You can see the car close to the end of the trailer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wL7cHJGvCY

As for the episode, I agree that it isn't among the best Joker episodes and doesn't hang together too coherently as a plot. Still, it has its fun moments. I like the bit about blackmailing Bruce into marrying the Joker's moll as well as the bit where Bruce gets dragged off to the looney bin. I don't really think there is a Joker episode that I don't enjoy at least somewhat, though. Also, the only Semple script that I really didn't like at all was the Liberace/Chandell episodes.

[Jaws63]

I haven't posted in awhile but that's because between work and my personal life I don't get the chance to play on the boards like I used to. I was quite active on the old board but went by a different user name back then. I was personally interested in this thread as I did my own episode reviews in the old forum, my review thread became somewhat signature for me.

One little tidbit from "That/Scat darn Catwoman worthy of note(I'm a little surprised nobody caught this or mentioned it...well one poster did ask the appropriate question). In the second half of this episode Rudy tells Pat " sometimes I wonder if your money would be safer in the bank(referring to the dough stashed under his mattress). Pat responds by telling Rudy, The money in the bank...was that safe from Catwoman?....referring to the fact there was a bank hold up In recent broadcasts this scene was elliminated , but it does exist. It's actually a missing scene from the first half. It's been a very long time since I've watched any of these episodes fully intact,(my memory sometimes fails me) but I think I remember Robin making a play for Catwoman in this "missing scene".

[chrisbcritter]

Re: "The Joker's Epitaph" - Anyone else notice the phrase Joker used to warn the robot henchmen? "Amber Alert!" That has taken on a whole new meaning now...

[gothosmansion]

"Catwoman Goes to College" features one of my favorite lines of the whole series, when Robin says, "You were taken in by her Batman, but I'm too young for that sort of thing." Brilliant.

The lengthy scene of Batman and Catwoman at the deserted house is a highlight as well. Witty script and great delivery by both Adam West and Julie Newmar. The ending where Batman captures Catwoman and the post-script where Catwoman tells Bruce there is only one man for her seemed a bit serious for the usually lighthearted series. I thought this was actually played "straighter" than her "death" at the end of That/Scat.

I would rank all of Julie Newmar's Catwoman episodes very highly, but this two part combo is a particular favorite, although I would place it just below Catwoman's first appearance in "Purr-fect Crime" and "That/Scat Darn Catwoman."

The only bad thing about the episode is that it would mark Julie's final appearance on the series. She would definitely be missed in the third season.

As a side note, the fourth season of The Beverly Hillbillies is scheduled for a DVD release (finally!) and features a guest appearance by Julie on the episode "The Beautiful Maid."