It seems to me most of the team ups weren't really team ups . you had a lead villain with another villain making a gust appearance.
The Zodiac Crimes was a Joker caper. Penguin made a brief appearance in part one and his contribution in part three wouldn't have been necessary if Joker hadn't failed in his attempts to kill B+R.
The Penguin three parter could have been a solo Penguin with a good moll. Marsha and Aunt Hilda provided a lot of filler.
Catwoman was basically shoe horned into a Sandman solo story.
Lola was a glorified moll to Penguin. Joker was pretty incidental to the Funny Feline Felonies/Joke's on Catwoman.
Even the movie was basically a Penguin story. Joker had almost nothing to do, Batman and Robin could have been lured in in some other witout Riddler's clues. Even Catwoman could have been replaced with a moll.A moll might have believably explained how Kitka took aAtman in and he didn't recognize her.
I guess this would raise the question how would you do a team up that is a team up with multiple villans beig indispensable.
Team Ups
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Mr. Deathtrap
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Re: Team Ups
Citizens,
As the movie stands, it seems to me the Joker is the most incidental villain to the story. Penguin is clearly in overall charge. Catwoman steps into the lead for the climactic kidnapping of the world leaders. Riddler steps into the lead when the gang decides to do away with the Dynamic Duo after the initial trap fails.
The Joker would have contributed his trick confetti to elude the air force in a scene that was abanddoned since the effect could not be realized. I lke to thnk he is responsible for luring our heroes to the projected yacht and the exploding shark while the Commodore is kidnapped.
Mr. Deathtrap
As the movie stands, it seems to me the Joker is the most incidental villain to the story. Penguin is clearly in overall charge. Catwoman steps into the lead for the climactic kidnapping of the world leaders. Riddler steps into the lead when the gang decides to do away with the Dynamic Duo after the initial trap fails.
The Joker would have contributed his trick confetti to elude the air force in a scene that was abanddoned since the effect could not be realized. I lke to thnk he is responsible for luring our heroes to the projected yacht and the exploding shark while the Commodore is kidnapped.
Mr. Deathtrap
Tune in for their exciting conclusion. Same Bat-Time! Same Bat - Channel!
Re: Team Ups
Joker was the most wasted villain when it came to team ups. He was pointless in the spin off movie, and was only there because of his popularity as one of the big four in the show. Then in the Catwoman team up in season 3, he just stood around while Catwoman gave the orders for one of the lamest villain capers in the show.
In all the other team ups at least the other villains contributed something to the caper. Penguin helped Joker's plan by seducing Venus and getting them into the Batcave. Marsha gave Penguin the capital to keep his movie studio going and distracted the guards while they broke into the treasury. Catwoman helped Sandman promote Dr. Sonambula on TV so J. Pauline Spaghetti would see her and call him. Lola provided the horse and the means to get into the Bruce Wayne handicap race.
What did Joker provide in the movie? Nothing. Riddler came up with the kidnap Bruce Wayne ploy, Catwoman was integral in that ploy, and Penguin was basically running the whole plan with his sub, jet pack umbrellas, breaking into the U.N. Building, getting into the Batcave, and basically giving all the orders.
As for the Catwoman team up, why did she need Joker to find that gun powder? He didn't contribute anything significant to that. He just followed her around like a lost lamb while she dictated everything.
In all the other team ups at least the other villains contributed something to the caper. Penguin helped Joker's plan by seducing Venus and getting them into the Batcave. Marsha gave Penguin the capital to keep his movie studio going and distracted the guards while they broke into the treasury. Catwoman helped Sandman promote Dr. Sonambula on TV so J. Pauline Spaghetti would see her and call him. Lola provided the horse and the means to get into the Bruce Wayne handicap race.
What did Joker provide in the movie? Nothing. Riddler came up with the kidnap Bruce Wayne ploy, Catwoman was integral in that ploy, and Penguin was basically running the whole plan with his sub, jet pack umbrellas, breaking into the U.N. Building, getting into the Batcave, and basically giving all the orders.
As for the Catwoman team up, why did she need Joker to find that gun powder? He didn't contribute anything significant to that. He just followed her around like a lost lamb while she dictated everything.
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celestialhost
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Re: Team Ups
I know the two Egghead/ Olga stories leave Egghead rather diminished, but they do seem to offer a genuine villain partnerships with both Olga and Egghead having equal stakes in the plot.
Re: Team Ups
Joel Eisner once wrote that for some reason, they only could have two-parters in season 3 if they had team-ups among villains. I don't understand why that became a rule, but it's clear that it was the case. So I think because of that, what we got were either mismatched villains (CW and Joker, Olga and Egghead) that make little sense together, or a second villain who functions more like a henchmoll (Lola, Calamity Jan, Peasoup).
'I thought Siren was perfect for Joan.'--Stanley Ralph Ross, writer of 'The Wail of the Siren'
My hobbies include gazing at the Siren and doing her bidding, evil or otherwise.
'She had a devastating, hypnotic effect on all the men.'--A schoolmate describing Joan Collins at age 17
My hobbies include gazing at the Siren and doing her bidding, evil or otherwise.
'She had a devastating, hypnotic effect on all the men.'--A schoolmate describing Joan Collins at age 17
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WayneGrayson
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Re: Team Ups
I thought the team ups were cool when I was a kid, but now it's (meh).
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elmrgraham
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Re: Team Ups
To me,the best villain/villainess team up was from the 1966 Batman movie.
Re: Team Ups
I totally agree with the opinion that the Joker was wasted during the Movie, he was certainly a bit part player. I mean come on, he was there is serve tea to the Commodore!?!
The Sandman episodes, were on the whole all about Sandman. However Catwoman was needed for the story to work. The police woman Mooney? (Was either Mooney or Moody) was undercover in Catwoman's gang. Her and Robin would not have ended up in the catacombs maze without Catwoman. Neither would have Sandman of had Catwoman go on TV in disguise to advertise Sandman/Dr Sandambula (I guess a moll could have done that part). But I do agree having a major villain playing basically second fiddle was lame.
The Egghead and Olga team-ups completely ruined the Egghead character for me. His appearance in the second season was easily one of the most ingenious capers written for the series. Egghead was caluclating and ruthless. With Olga he is a totally different person, a scared whiney brat.
The Joker and Penguin team-ups I guess Penguin was needed into tricking Venus into the batcave. But you can argue over three episodes he could have featured in the story a great deal more.
For me I thought the best team up was Marsha and Penguin. They both complimented each other rather well and would agree they both needed each other equally for the plot to go down.
The Sandman episodes, were on the whole all about Sandman. However Catwoman was needed for the story to work. The police woman Mooney? (Was either Mooney or Moody) was undercover in Catwoman's gang. Her and Robin would not have ended up in the catacombs maze without Catwoman. Neither would have Sandman of had Catwoman go on TV in disguise to advertise Sandman/Dr Sandambula (I guess a moll could have done that part). But I do agree having a major villain playing basically second fiddle was lame.
The Egghead and Olga team-ups completely ruined the Egghead character for me. His appearance in the second season was easily one of the most ingenious capers written for the series. Egghead was caluclating and ruthless. With Olga he is a totally different person, a scared whiney brat.
The Joker and Penguin team-ups I guess Penguin was needed into tricking Venus into the batcave. But you can argue over three episodes he could have featured in the story a great deal more.
For me I thought the best team up was Marsha and Penguin. They both complimented each other rather well and would agree they both needed each other equally for the plot to go down.
Re: Team Ups
It's awesome. Well done.E-2 Robin wrote:Nicole nad myself recreate the infamous submarine scene! Enjoy!
"It's like a dream Pengy sweet. Nothing can stop us now"
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Gorshin Romero
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Re: Team Ups
On land YOU may command, but at sea, it is ME! Quack...Quack...Quack...Quack...Quack...
Re: Team Ups
The requirement that villains team up to get multi-part episodes in Season 3 suggests a fun missed opportunity to reunite the United Underworld members in a major caper with more room for everyone to play: Replace Lola with Catwoman in "The Sport of Penguins"/"A Horse of Another Color" and merge that two-parter with the similarly plotted "Ring Around The Riddler" and "Surfs Up! Joker's Under" to create a four-part "Wide Underworld of Sports" super-event!
Kick off the action with an archcriminal summit in which each villain puts up some stolen loot in a bet over who can land the biggest "score" by hijacking a Gotham sports event. The winner gets everything put up for the wager, plus dibs on offing the Tremendous Trio. This would add some much-needed "plausible" motivation to the surfing and boxing plotlines.
Having multiple villains/crimes at once would have allowed use of a device that was common in comics, but seldom used on the show -- heroes spinning off on solo missions while maintaining contact and coordinating their activities. Having Batman, Robin and Batgirl each team up with a civilian partner (Alfred, Gordon, O'Hara) would have allowed some fun character development. (A Gordon-Batgirl team-up would've been especially fun, with the secret identity hijinks that could ensue, perhaps with the Commissioner growing increasingly concerned about Barbara's whereabouts.)
ABC might have even been persuaded to loan Jim McKay to the proceedings. Holy agony of defeat!
Cheers,
QQ
Kick off the action with an archcriminal summit in which each villain puts up some stolen loot in a bet over who can land the biggest "score" by hijacking a Gotham sports event. The winner gets everything put up for the wager, plus dibs on offing the Tremendous Trio. This would add some much-needed "plausible" motivation to the surfing and boxing plotlines.
Having multiple villains/crimes at once would have allowed use of a device that was common in comics, but seldom used on the show -- heroes spinning off on solo missions while maintaining contact and coordinating their activities. Having Batman, Robin and Batgirl each team up with a civilian partner (Alfred, Gordon, O'Hara) would have allowed some fun character development. (A Gordon-Batgirl team-up would've been especially fun, with the secret identity hijinks that could ensue, perhaps with the Commissioner growing increasingly concerned about Barbara's whereabouts.)
ABC might have even been persuaded to loan Jim McKay to the proceedings. Holy agony of defeat!
Cheers,