Zelda straightest episodes?

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High C
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by High C »

Ben Bentley wrote: To me this episode was a symbolic flirtation with a direction and freedom from what we consider to be the formulaic nature of these two-part narratives. In retrospect, the part I find most bizarre is the notion that the show-runners were already trying to play with the structure and per-requisites merely two months into the show's original broadcast run, keeping in mind that their original audience had yet to meet such iconic villains such as Catwoman.

For better or for worse, I found Anne Baxter a lot more tangible and tolerable as Zelda than I did two seasons further down the road as Olga.
Agree 1000 percent on Baxter. Olga was a caricature from jump street and never resembled an actual human being, which the even more outrageous costumed villains should manage to do.

I've always been generally positive about this ep, but the flaws are obvious. 1. The villainess is weak. Villains being blackmailed by others aren't as much fun as purely evil villains. I realize Lorenzo Semple Jr. changed the Zelda character from a male in the comic story that inspired this, but still, writing strong female characters wasn't in his wheelhouse, and this one wasn't strong.

2. It seemed they didn't want to fully commit to the 'normal villainess' in that they included Zelda breaking the fourth wall at one point, and the ridiculous scene of her knitting while the Aunt Harriet stunt double is doing windsprints above the boiling oil. If you're going to be serious, then do it consistently.

I wouldn't be surprised if this garnered neither good ratings nor word-of-mouth buzz. It's telling there was never another non-costumed villain until some of the season 3 duds.
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Ben Bentley
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by Ben Bentley »

High C wrote:
Ben Bentley wrote: To me this episode was a symbolic flirtation with a direction and freedom from what we consider to be the formulaic nature of these two-part narratives. In retrospect, the part I find most bizarre is the notion that the show-runners were already trying to play with the structure and per-requisites merely two months into the show's original broadcast run, keeping in mind that their original audience had yet to meet such iconic villains such as Catwoman.

For better or for worse, I found Anne Baxter a lot more tangible and tolerable as Zelda than I did two seasons further down the road as Olga.
I wouldn't be surprised if this garnered neither good ratings nor word-of-mouth buzz. It's telling there was never another non-costumed villain until some of the season 3 duds.
Those are exactly my thoughts on the matter. Airing chronologically straight after what we now consider to be an iconic and archetypal Mr Freeze storyline, it's easy to understand why an attentive audience at that point may have been less than thrilled by the direction taken in the following week's two-parter.
Jaws63
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by Jaws63 »

The Zelda episodes are within my top 5 favorites of the series. On top of the fact that I agree that the episodes in themselves were something of a departure from the norm, Zelda had many layers to her character...rare in a 66bat-character.
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Progress Pigment
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by Progress Pigment »

Jaws63 wrote:The Zelda episodes are within my top 5 favorites of the series. On top of the fact that I agree that the episodes in themselves were something of a departure from the norm, Zelda had many layers to her character...rare in a 66bat-character.
I'd agree, top five or ten. The only "camp" things in the episode were Aunt Harriet roped bizarrely in the deathtrap kicking her legs, Dick Grayson's "plea", and Batman saying with a big grin, "What's the big idea genius?" in the 2nd episode. But a lot to love here. It's somewhat eerie in the same way as the Falseface episode. The bat figure turning to a skeleton, and the gangsters being machine gunned among the mummies. Seriously, if the second and third season episodes had been this good, the series would have never fallen into disrepute with comics fans.

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Quarhog
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by Quarhog »

Progress Pigment wrote:
Jaws63 wrote:The Zelda episodes are within my top 5 favorites of the series. On top of the fact that I agree that the episodes in themselves were something of a departure from the norm, Zelda had many layers to her character...rare in a 66bat-character.
I'd agree, top five or ten. The only "camp" things in the episode were Aunt Harriet roped bizarrely in the deathtrap kicking her legs, Dick Grayson's "plea", and Batman saying with a big grin, "What's the big idea genius?" in the 2nd episode. But a lot to love here. It's somewhat eerie in the same way as the Falseface episode. The bat figure turning to a skeleton, and the gangsters being machine gunned among the mummies. Seriously, if the second and third season episodes had been this good, the series would have never fallen into disrepute with comics fans.

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Despite attaching a picture of Zelda in prison uniform, you neglected to mention that in keeping with the relatively serious and 'realistic' tone of the series at this early stage, Zelda is one of the VERY few Bat-villains ever to be seen in convicts' stripes (correct me if I'm wrong, but Chandell and Ma Parker were, I believe, the only other ones). Ms Baxter looks so much sexier in the outfit she wears in the final penitentiary sequence that she did anywhere else in the narrative that its too bad we never saw Ms Newmar model it in any of her frequent appearances in custody...
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Progress Pigment
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by Progress Pigment »

I think the outfit was somewhat overdone to be a bit "camp". The large stripes, and hat cocked to one side was a bit much. But, I agree, she looked incredible in it. (Although I can't find a still.) The regular Zelda outfit was a bit matronly. I don't even think "Legs" from Ma Parker filled it out as well. And considering how frugal the Batman producers were, it was probably the same suit.

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Quarhog
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by Quarhog »

Progress Pigment wrote:I think the outfit was somewhat overdone to be a bit "camp". The large stripes, and hat cocked to one side was a bit much. But, I agree, she looked incredible in it. (Although I can't find a still.) The regular Zelda outfit was a bit matronly. I don't even think "Legs" from Ma Parker filled it out as well. And considering how frugal the Batman producers were, it was probably the same suit.

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Doe, Rae, and Mimi are wearing prison outfits in the final scene of 'The Dead Ringers', but sadly we don't get a good look at them thus attired.

I agree that we could have done without the silly little hat. The best part of the prison interview sequence comes at the conclusion when Zelda a little unsteadily rises to her feet and as she is lead back to her cell we are treated to a delightful, and quite lengthy, view of her hips swinging from side to side as she walks back down the corridor to the accompaniment of a wistful little saxophone piece; the likes of which we never hear again anywhere else during the series, and which lends a melancholy and 'serious' mood to the conclusion of Zelda's story the likes of which we wouldn't see again.
robinboyblunderer
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by robinboyblunderer »

I find Zelda refreshing only because of how little I've seen it. Unlike other episodes that I've seen over and over and over; I never cared for Zelda, so now ironically, bat-ironically, the episodes are rather new to me.

However, I'm glad the show didn't follow this pattern in terms of villains. Zelda and Ekdel just weren't that interesting. Had they kept the feel of these episodes, maybe the show would've lasted longer and every so often, it would've been a nice change of pace to have a different, less campy villain.

cheers
WayneGrayson
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by WayneGrayson »

Bat-Tiger wrote:
Ben Bentley wrote: For better or for worse, I found Anne Baxter a lot more tangible and tolerable as Zelda than I did two seasons further down the road as Olga.
Me too.
Me three. I like Eggie on his own, Olga just annoyed me, although I thought it was funny when she called our hero "Batooshka" (or "Batushka")
WayneGrayson
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Re: Zelda straightest episodes?

Post by WayneGrayson »

Quarhog wrote:
Progress Pigment wrote:I think the outfit was somewhat overdone to be a bit "camp". The large stripes, and hat cocked to one side was a bit much. But, I agree, she looked incredible in it. (Although I can't find a still.) The regular Zelda outfit was a bit matronly. I don't even think "Legs" from Ma Parker filled it out as well. And considering how frugal the Batman producers were, it was probably the same suit.

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I agree that we could have done without the silly little hat.
HOLY HABERDASHERY! THE HAT! I saw that and thought "they're kidding, right?"
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