Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

General goings on in the 1966 Batman World

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bat-rss
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Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by bat-rss » Wed May 01, 2019 11:58 pm

At the Bowling Green State University Batman Conference last month, one of the presenters was a lawyer, Jim Dedman from North Carolina, who talked about courtroom-related stories in Batman comics. We're scheduling him to come on TO THE BATPOLES podcast and talk about courtroom-related stuff on the show. Of course, there were only, as far as I remember, two courtroom scenes in the series: THE BIRD'S LAST JEST and THE JOKE'S ON CATWOMAN. But we're trying to think of other law-related things from the show we can discuss with him, and where better to get suggestions than the all-seeing, all-knowing 66 Batman message board?

Jim is an "experienced litigator with extensive experience in handling complex personal injury and business litigation," according to his web profile. We're expecting to record with him in the second half of May.

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epaddon
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by epaddon » Thu May 02, 2019 12:41 am

Well, when they had to split up the Egghead-Olga trilogy into two parts and a later episode, one of the "covering" scenes they shot for "The Ogg Couple" had Gordon saying that "Egghead is out on a technicality." What technicality I wonder helped Egghead get out to terrorize viewers with yet another insufferable episode??

The pilot of course deals with Riddler's manipulations into suing Batman so he can be forced to reveal his identity in court.

Also, in "Fine Feathered Finks", Batman and Robin are stopped cold when Penguin points out that legally once the umbrellas leave the factory he as the manufacturer isn't responsible for what happens to them or what they do.

And I might as well beat High C to the punch and note Siren forcing Bruce Wayne to sign over everything to her which gives her the legal right to tell Robin and Batgirl they are trespassing! :)

One might also ask if Batman and Alfred engage in illegal activity by producing false documents to get the wedding to Marsha stopped! (there are I am sure some statutes that would make it illegal to create a false marriage license)

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High C
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by High C » Thu May 02, 2019 4:33 am

Great idea for a show!

As I indicated before, can Dozier's pardon be revoked under 'crimes versus humanity' for the 'lyrics' to the Batgirl theme?
epaddon wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 12:41 am
Well, when they had to split up the Egghead-Olga trilogy into two parts and a later episode, one of the "covering" scenes they shot for "The Ogg Couple" had Gordon saying that "Egghead is out on a technicality." What technicality I wonder helped Egghead get out to terrorize viewers with yet another insufferable episode??
HAHA
epaddon wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 12:41 am
And I might as well beat High C to the punch and note Siren forcing Bruce Wayne to sign over everything to her which gives her the legal right to tell Robin and Batgirl they are trespassing! :)
Re Siren, I do wonder, after Keith DeCandido mentioned this in his tor.com review, if Bruce's signature was binding yet? Would Siren have needed a notary public? (I suspect she could have found a cooperative male one rather easily!)

Also, what exactly would be the legal charge against her? Attempted assisted suicide? (Two counts) Or would Bruce have had a better chance versus Siren in civil court??

And if we take on the question of all the mind-controlling female villains, would devices and chemicals such as love darts, Cataphrenic and cerebrum short-circuiters make a case easier to prove than one against The Siren, who could claim she can't help it that men hear her voice and want to surrender their life savings to her...
'I thought Siren was perfect for Joan.'--Stanley Ralph Ross, writer of 'The Wail of the Siren'

My hobbies include gazing at the Siren and doing her bidding, evil or otherwise.

'She had a devastating, hypnotic effect on all the men.'--A schoolmate describing Joan Collins at age 17

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bat-rss
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by bat-rss » Thu May 02, 2019 6:09 am

Yes, yes, love it! Keep 'em coming!

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clavierankh
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by clavierankh » Thu May 02, 2019 6:34 am

Do Batman and Robin violate constitutional rights doing Batclimbs spying on villains and breaking into their hideouts., planting tracking devices and bugs.

How has what's allowed changed from 1966 to now. I think Miranda decision was about this time.

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epaddon
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by epaddon » Thu May 02, 2019 7:54 am

Addendum to Batman/Alfred perhaps breaking the law with fake legal documents in Marsha. Is Gordon also by approving of this compounding a crime? :)

In the Londinium trilogy, isn't Gordon unlawfully taking charge of an investigation out of his jurisdiction?

And High C's mention about Cataphrenic raises the question of whether Robin should technically face charges for being involved in the crimes he was part of with Catwoman's gang! I can see him getting off the hook for the Wayne Manor theft because Bruce Wayne could decide not to press charges against *any* of the gang for that offense, and let the gang be charged with other crimes they committed but since Robin took part in crimes independent of that, then therefore he would seemingly need to mount a legal defense of being forced to do something against his will (and at bare minimum appear before the DA who would decide not to prosecute)

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dell
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by dell » Thu May 02, 2019 9:26 am

High C wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 4:33 am
...
Also, what exactly would be the legal charge against her? Attempted assisted suicide? (Two counts) Or would Bruce have had a better chance versus Siren in civil court??...
I would think extortion or something similar. Someone in their right mind would not sign over everything they own to a stranger.

On Dragnet they always seemed to be working with the "bunko squad". I think in the era of Batman they would have no problem cooking up bunko type offenses against The Siren. Now whether they would stick, or just slide right off that shiny mini dress is another question!
dell

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epaddon
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by epaddon » Thu May 02, 2019 3:16 pm

Well the problem is unless that's done in the presence of a bunko operative, there'd be no evidence at this point. Even assuming the effect of Siren's note wore off, if questioned later, Bruce would have to say "I don't remember" when asked if he was forced to sign anything over against his will (just like the Commissoner didn't remember anything he did). Wouldn't be enough in the literal sense.

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bat-rss
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by bat-rss » Thu May 02, 2019 3:56 pm

clavierankh wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 6:34 am
Do Batman and Robin violate constitutional rights doing Batclimbs spying on villains and breaking into their hideouts., planting tracking devices and bugs.

How has what's allowed changed from 1966 to now. I think Miranda decision was about this time.
Ooh, yes, I remember we talked on the podcast about how Miranda was referred to once, obliquely, on the show. Gordon and O'Hara were interrogating someone. I'm blanking on the episode right now.

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John Mack
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by John Mack » Thu May 02, 2019 4:06 pm

Miranda wasn't ABOUT this time, it was EXACTLY this time:
In Miranda v. Arizona (1966), the Supreme Court held that the admission of an elicited incriminating statement by a suspect not informed of these rights violates the Fifth Amendment and the Sixth Amendment right to counsel, through the incorporation of these rights into state law.Thus, if law enforcement officials decline to offer a Miranda warning to an individual in their custody, they may interrogate that person and act upon the knowledge gained, but may not use that person's statements as evidence against them in a criminal trial.
Music. BAT! Music.

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clavierankh
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by clavierankh » Thu May 02, 2019 4:22 pm

Wasn't the Miranda case specifically that he was not given his rights in Spanish?

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High C
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by High C » Thu May 02, 2019 5:34 pm

Here is the wikipedia summary of Ernesto Miranda's troubled life and his landmark case. FWIW, the Supreme Court decision came down on June 13, 1966, in between the first and second seasons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernesto_Miranda
'I thought Siren was perfect for Joan.'--Stanley Ralph Ross, writer of 'The Wail of the Siren'

My hobbies include gazing at the Siren and doing her bidding, evil or otherwise.

'She had a devastating, hypnotic effect on all the men.'--A schoolmate describing Joan Collins at age 17

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Mr. Glee
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by Mr. Glee » Thu May 02, 2019 7:06 pm

The scenes featuring Harry's "criminal attorney" Mr. Sly, in the Chandell episodes, might be fertile ground for legal analysis.

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John Mack
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by John Mack » Thu May 02, 2019 7:26 pm

Mr. Glee wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 7:06 pm
The scenes featuring Harry's "criminal attorney" Mr. Sly, in the Chandell episodes, might be fertile ground for legal analysis.
And as an aside here, the Zip Code came about in 1963, and people were still complaining about the "long numbers" you had to use as referenced in that episode....9999999....79. Lol
Music. BAT! Music.

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chrisbcritter
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by chrisbcritter » Thu May 02, 2019 10:57 pm

What about one of the pilot's plot points - Riddler's lawsuit against Batman and Robin? Granted it didn't get into court...

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