Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

General goings on in the 1966 Batman World

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Commodore Schmidlapp
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by Commodore Schmidlapp » Fri May 03, 2019 1:48 am

In The Penguin Goes Straight deathtrap, Gordon and O'Hara fire what they believe to be pop guns at a carnival target, not knowing Batman and Robin were hanging behind the curtain.

After they escaped, Batman wouldn't go after Penguin since it was the commissioner and police chief who fired the shots. Batman also mentioned that he and Robin were trespassing.

Could Gordon and O'Hara legally be held accountable as Batman believed, even though they were clearly setup?

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Dr. Shimel
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by Dr. Shimel » Sat May 04, 2019 3:59 pm

*In the first Mad Hatter, the source of his animus toward Batman was because the Caped Crusader had testified against him.

*In the Joker robot/bank ep, (presumed) legal steps are taken to commit Bruce to a mental hospital because he appointed Joker bank president.

*In the Catwoman college episode, Captain Courageous arrests Batman, but his "lawyer" Alfred gets him out by changing identities (sort of).

*A few months earlier, Penguin's attempt to get sentenced to GC Prison is foiled when the judge lets him go with a lecture. Batman had replaced Jefferson Hamfurter as prosecutor.

*Adding to previous mentions: The Gordon/O'Hara interrogation of Evil Brother Harry (Chandell) is stopped by Mr. Slye. Prior to the shyster's appearance, O'Hara is ready to break out the rubber hose until Gordon explains that he's "violently opposed to police brutality."

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dell
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by dell » Sat May 04, 2019 5:08 pm

Commodore Schmidlapp wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 1:48 am
In The Penguin Goes Straight deathtrap, Gordon and O'Hara fire what they believe to be pop guns at a carnival target, not knowing Batman and Robin were hanging behind the curtain.

After they escaped, Batman wouldn't go after Penguin since it was the commissioner and police chief who fired the shots. Batman also mentioned that he and Robin were trespassing.

Could Gordon and O'Hara legally be held accountable as Batman believed, even though they were clearly setup?
Maybe in Gotham City, but nowhere else.
dell

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bat-rss
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by bat-rss » Mon May 06, 2019 4:53 am

I think that'll be enough for our episode, but if you think of any other really obvious, pressing ones, let us know! Thanks very much!

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Lord Death Man
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by Lord Death Man » Mon May 06, 2019 9:30 pm

I think these are the same folks that did a seminar about the legal ramifications of kaiju and the differing liabilities resulting from their actions and such (like Carl Denham's liability for bringing King Kong to New York, or if insurance policies would cover damage from kaiju attacks). An excellent and thought provoking presentation.
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High C
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by High C » Fri May 10, 2019 10:37 pm

dell wrote:
Thu May 02, 2019 9:26 am

I would think extortion or something similar. Someone in their right mind would not sign over everything they own to a stranger.

On Dragnet they always seemed to be working with the "bunko squad". I think in the era of Batman they would have no problem cooking up bunko type offenses against The Siren. Now whether they would stick, or just slide right off that shiny mini dress is another question!
Yes, I found a 1950 movie called 'Bunco Squad,' so it is spelled with a C. Your point is well-taken. To summarize, I would say this:

Again, let's cut out everything in 'Wail' other than Siren enchanting Bruce Wayne into forking over all of his assets. Now let's say the plot was that Siren had done that to multiple wealthy men in Gotham City. They all have no recollection of what has happened, other than that their assets have been signed over to somebody named Lorelei Circe. (That's why it's important to give her a name, because 'Siren' wouldn't be legally binding at all!)

At this point, there is no way this sticks to Siren legally, IMO. She can deny any coercion and the men cannot be witnesses because they have forgotten everything. So, as dell said, I think the police would have to set up a sting and have a man wear a wire and go on a date with world-famous chanteuse Lorelei Circe.

I am willing to volunteer...
'I thought Siren was perfect for Joan.'--Stanley Ralph Ross, writer of 'The Wail of the Siren'

My hobbies include gazing at the Siren and doing her bidding, evil or otherwise.

'She had a devastating, hypnotic effect on all the men.'--A schoolmate describing Joan Collins at age 17

elmrgraham
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by elmrgraham » Sat May 11, 2019 4:00 am

Me too.

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High C
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by High C » Sat May 11, 2019 6:04 am

High C wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 10:37 pm

Yes, I found a 1950 movie called 'Bunco Squad,' so it is spelled with a C. Your point is well-taken. To summarize, I would say this:

Again, let's cut out everything in 'Wail' other than Siren enchanting Bruce Wayne into forking over all of his assets. Now let's say the plot was that Siren had done that to multiple wealthy men in Gotham City. They all have no recollection of what has happened, other than that their assets have been signed over to somebody named Lorelei Circe. (That's why it's important to give her a name, because 'Siren' wouldn't be legally binding at all!)

At this point, there is no way this sticks to Siren legally, IMO. She can deny any coercion and the men cannot be witnesses because they have forgotten everything. So, as dell said, I think the police would have to set up a sting and have a man wear a wire and go on a date with world-famous chanteuse Lorelei Circe.

I am willing to volunteer...
I should add another question would be the legalities of Batman and Robin, as duly deputized reps of the GCPD, planting listening devices in Siren's newly-acquired building, in Minstrel moll Octavia's purse, etc.
'I thought Siren was perfect for Joan.'--Stanley Ralph Ross, writer of 'The Wail of the Siren'

My hobbies include gazing at the Siren and doing her bidding, evil or otherwise.

'She had a devastating, hypnotic effect on all the men.'--A schoolmate describing Joan Collins at age 17

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dell
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by dell » Sat May 11, 2019 9:24 am

High C wrote:
Sat May 11, 2019 6:04 am
I should add another question would be the legalities of Batman and Robin, as duly deputized reps of the GCPD, planting listening devices in Siren's newly-acquired building, in Minstrel moll Octavia's purse, etc.
Listening devices were almost the stuff of science fiction at this point in time. Batman had them, but no one else did. Remember Chief O'Hara's fascination with Barbara Gordon's answering machine?

It is almost certain there were no laws against bugs, but equally certain that there were no laws allowing their use to record a criminal and use that as evidence. It is anyone's guess as to whether this was admissible in Gotham City's bizarre court system.
dell

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High C
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by High C » Sat May 11, 2019 2:01 pm

dell wrote:
Sat May 11, 2019 9:24 am

Listening devices were almost the stuff of science fiction at this point in time. Batman had them, but no one else did. Remember Chief O'Hara's fascination with Barbara Gordon's answering machine?

It is almost certain there were no laws against bugs, but equally certain that there were no laws allowing their use to record a criminal and use that as evidence. It is anyone's guess as to whether this was admissible in Gotham City's bizarre court system.
Exactly. So that's why the question is what would or wouldn't be admissible in the real world nowadays. I'm sure it's a lot different and it will be interesting to find out.
'I thought Siren was perfect for Joan.'--Stanley Ralph Ross, writer of 'The Wail of the Siren'

My hobbies include gazing at the Siren and doing her bidding, evil or otherwise.

'She had a devastating, hypnotic effect on all the men.'--A schoolmate describing Joan Collins at age 17

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clavierankh
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by clavierankh » Sun May 12, 2019 9:57 am

As for the Siren question , Batgirl saw the Siren put fighters under her spell. That would provide evidence and create question as to whether millionaires signed of their property to Siren of there own free will.

Another point, could Batman, Robin and Batgirl testify in court against villains without revealing their identities. Defense has the right to impeach witnesses if they can and would have the right to as much information as possible on the witnesses.

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High C
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by High C » Sun May 12, 2019 1:45 pm

clavierankh wrote:
Sun May 12, 2019 9:57 am
As for the Siren question , Batgirl saw the Siren put fighters under her spell. That would provide evidence and create question as to whether millionaires signed of their property to Siren of there own free will.
Actually, she did not. Batgirl was in the steam room by then and had no knowledge of the boxers being hypnotized by The Siren.
Another point, could Batman, Robin and Batgirl testify in court against villains without revealing their identities. Defense has the right to impeach witnesses if they can and would have the right to as much information as possible on the witnesses.
That's an excellent question.
'I thought Siren was perfect for Joan.'--Stanley Ralph Ross, writer of 'The Wail of the Siren'

My hobbies include gazing at the Siren and doing her bidding, evil or otherwise.

'She had a devastating, hypnotic effect on all the men.'--A schoolmate describing Joan Collins at age 17

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epaddon
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by epaddon » Sun May 12, 2019 1:53 pm

Maybe *that's* why these criminals always get such light sentences, since Batman and Robin can never testify openly in court against them! (and thus they plea bargain out to light sentences and get out very quickly in time for another episode)

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High C
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Re: Courtroom scenes and other bat-law questions

Post by High C » Thu Jun 13, 2019 5:31 am

Bumping this up because of the legal-themed podcast being released today,

http://tothebatpoles.libsyn.com/112-cou ... he-66-show
'I thought Siren was perfect for Joan.'--Stanley Ralph Ross, writer of 'The Wail of the Siren'

My hobbies include gazing at the Siren and doing her bidding, evil or otherwise.

'She had a devastating, hypnotic effect on all the men.'--A schoolmate describing Joan Collins at age 17

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